I hate it as much as anyone else at the moment, and maybe I’m just an optimist, but once more support starts rolling out I think it’s going to be great.

thank mr skeltal

Do it!

I asked you to define the term to highlight that what you’re referring to is untestable and as you pointed out unmeasurable.

I’m not suggesting you apply the scientific method to spirituality, though. I’m suggesting that Cause can be unmeasurable. If we can do that, it opens up possibilities for new understanding.

I think the material world can only be half explained by modern physics. (I have a few reasons for coming to this conclusion, which I’ll share if you care to hear them. It’s hard for me to type out, I can explain myself better in speech, if that makes sense.)

And that’s fair. But it’s always going to have that margin of error until it doesn’t, it has been my actual, lived experience online that you can bet on an Atheist to be a complete dick to anyone even hinting to a supernatural belief. (Look at these comments.) You (generally speaking) don’t get to go around being a giant dick to the “other team” like that with any margin of error.

I genuinely feel that we aren’t going to science ourselves into the Star Trek future. Corruptibility is Humanities Achilles Heel, and I don’t see how we science our way out of that.

You make a lot of good, valid points.

I’m not here simping for religion, I promise. The concept of god can and does exist separately from religion.

Yeah, I know horrific things have been done in the name of big G God, but those things were done by people. Not a god, or God, not spirituality. Allowing that to narrow your worldview to only things we can directly observe and quantify is leaving an entire realm of understanding on the table.

I know where I am, I’m just wondering why other people are here.

Imagine I created a community around my belief that flying pigs didn’t exist and all the content was shitting on the people who did… What do I get out of that other than putting people down? It literally widens the division in the name of scoring meaningless points against “the other team.”

Religion isn’t a cohesive group, and judging everyone who participates because certain sects are deplorable isn’t very “enlightened.”

Spirituality, God, and Religion are all separate things. And if you have any research on when and why any of those concepts were created I’d love to read them.

You have to understand that the problem here is bad people, not bad ideas.

Edit: Misread your reply.

I agree. It doesn’t provide any proof. Speculater was asking for a definition of a spiritual explanation and I was just giving an example.

Spiritual means different things to different people, and they’re right, I think a lot of these kinds of discussions would go a lot better with some baseline definitions.

That being said… Virtually 100% of the time, I’ll go with scientific consensus. My entire argument is that we’ve swung pretty far into physical science when I think there’s an entire realm of understanding that we’re leaving generally untapped because we can’t make a graph out of it (yet)

Why? Because people do horrific shit in the name of god? People do horrific shit in the name of science, too.

Atheists go on about proof of everything, yet any time I ask for proof that some type of “god” doesn’t exist I get the burden of proof line.

…my position is that it’s unknown. The burden of proof isn’t on me.

Yeah, the meme starting with “Your inability to understand basic science” is definitely not meant to belittle or shame anyone.

Good call. My bad.

Science has, too. Splitting the atom had some pretty harsh consequences.

It wasn’t science’ s fault though, was it? No. It was people using science to hurt others.

lack of evidence is, itself, evidence that a thing does not exist.

100% disagree.

You don’t have to bet against it, though.

What do you gain by putting down other belief systems?

The Placebo Effect is, in my opinion, -is- the power of belief. (And I think it can do more than that, but that would mean going into my woowoo closet. We’ll just leave it shut for now.)

I know spirituality doesn’t put people on the moon and it doesn’t do much for the economy. (Worship on the other hand…oof.)

Anyway. My point is the pendulum swung hard because religion as we know it fucking sucks, and there is more material value in science. But that doesn’t mean spirituality is worthless.

I think we’re capable of more than what science alone can teach us.

Thanks, I appreciate it ☺️

Don’t get me wrong. I side with science virtually 100% of the time, I just think there is understanding to be had in areas that we currently see as taboo.

I love how saying ”Hey, maybe we don’t know everything yet, and belittling people who have differing opinions is a dick move." gets downvotes in a supposedly science centric community.

(And just to clarify, I’m replying to my own comment as a broad reply to others.)

If I discovered a god drug I’d open source it, lol.

Hahaha. Well done 😝

Still working on my answer to the question, but I think you’re in the ballpark, in a way.

All of current science. We won’t know what we don’t know until we know everything.

We still burn dinosaur juice that is slowly suffocating us, we poison our fresh water and turn our oceans into plastic hellscapes.

How far in our evolution and understanding do you think we are?

Science has yet to explain why it happened, or what if anything came before. Those are not “tiny gaps”