You get genocide either way; one is a guy trying to stop the genocide that’s been negotiating behind the scenes for months (and yes, also giving the Israelis arms), and the other guy wants to accelerate the genocide while also ending democracy.
one is a guy trying to stop the genocide that’s been negotiating behind the scenes for months
I don’t believe you. Or more accurately, I don’t believe the alleged “leaks” from the White House about how mad Joe Biden is but it’s behind closed doors just trust me bro. This guy has been hard in the pocket for Israel his entire career, why wouldn’t he be now?
Mostly because Netanyahu has been souring on Biden real fast. Biden held up a delivery of bombs to Israel back in May, citing Israel’s plans to bomb Rafah. Netanyahu announced he was pushing forward anyway, and there was a big public spat about it. That sort of thing has been happening since Oct 7.
I mean one could say it’s all an act or something, but that strains credulity to me.
I’m not saying Biden is doing great here, I’d much prefer he take Bernie Sanders’ advice on this and stop weapon deliveries altogether. But it’s certainly fair to assess that Biden wants the genocide to stop, but is not doing enough to stop it.
It’s difficult to defend the idea that Biden has been trying to end the genocide. He’s had that power from day 1. If you give Israel a bullet, you have solid awareness that there is a good chance it will be used against a non-combatant. That’s hard reality. If Biden was not supportive of genocide he would place an embargo on the weapons being poured into the massacre. He also wouldn’t sanction the ICC when they attempted to call out the primary actors in the genocide. He has given enabling support to the campaign in multiple ways.
Biden is not a good man as he is portrayed, he is complex obviously, but the reality is that Hitler still petted his dog and was nice to his friends and family. Biden should be joining Netanyahu at the Hague, not sabotaging democracy by being virtually un-electable while at the same time working to make it even more obvious that the international order is only there to punish certain war criminals.
Not as such, no. When congress appropriates funds, the president is legally obligated to disburse those funds for the purpose that they were appropriated for. This is a law, and it’s not something that’s up for debate. That was part of the underlying crime that Trump was first impeached for; he attempted to withhold funds corruptly. Could he have vetoed that? Sure. It also would have vetoed funding for Ukraine though. (And, just pointing out here that Trump would have vetoed assistance for Ukraine, while helping Israel kill more Palestinians faster.)
You can–and should–condemn his rhetoric, because he has been supportive of Israel waging war in Gaza. But he’s also been working behind the scenes, trying to negotiate a peace that Hamas will accept, and that Israel will accept. Even when he’s supporting Israel in public, it’s been clear that he’s been working to negotiate a truce.
The US also has laws against providing arms to military units that have been credibly accused of war crimes, but in Israel (also Ukraine) they simply don’t investigate allegations in order to keep the arms flowing. If Biden wants a legal casus belli to deny Israel arms, he has many to choose from, but he is actively choosing not to employ them.
He would need some kind of finding of fact in the US to support that, and that hasn’t happened AFAIK yet. The ICC has made that finding, but it wouldn’t be legally supportable to use that finding to withhold appropriated funding.
In fact the US is so NOT a member of the ICC that it’s currently federal law that if a US soldier was being held at the Hague, the US military would be obligated to invade The Netherlands in order to recover them
Or. Just maybe. We could actually care enough to pressure Biden.
No? Just going to shove your head in the ground and pretend politics is an immutable object?
I can’t imagine why Biden was already in so much polling trouble. It can’t possibly be the cult like atmosphere around him preventing him from contacting reality.
…And exactly, EXACTLY, how do you pressure him in a way that doesn’t actively risk making things far, far worse, not just in Israel, but here in the US as well? Because if your answer is, “don’t vote for him”, well, congrats, you’re going to make things worse.
You let them know. You don’t just sit on it. The one thing that will move a politician is knowing they can’t get elected again if they keep doing something. By throwing “But Trump!” at us, no matter how obliquely, you’re just protecting a genocide.
one thing that will move a politician is knowing they can’t get elected again
If you do that with Biden, that means that Trump gets elected, and shit gets a whole helluva lot worse. Not just in Palestine, but everywhere. Of course, you’re going to say that I’m "throwing ‘But Trump!’ at you, but that’s not me - that’s the system that we live in.
You have a functionally binary choice. You can try to minimize damage, or not.
It’s your choice whether you, personally, do what you are capable of doing to minimize damage. And I hope that you have the intestinal fortitude to tell your LGBTQ+ friends to their face what you did, and why you did it, if it all goes the way I expect it will.
Yes, he’ll learn a lot by not being in office anymore. Then someone else will have the power to aid Isreal explicitly to carry out a genocide. But Biden will know. He’ll never hold office again , but hay. He’ll know. As the Supreme Court sactions the legalism of a Trump dictatorship and approve a continuation of the Japanese Internment Act. Expanded to all the other not-white people. Just as they argued during his first term, but Biden will know. Biden will have learned his lesson. While he has no political power of any kind. And when they’re shoving people in trucks and on boats without sufficient supplies to be dummped into places they aren’t from and have no resources to survive, and Biden will be sitting at home having fully learned his lesson.
Ah yes. The insular Biden cult. I don’t know how deluded you need to be to buy this. No one, Not one person is in a cult of personality for Unkie Joe. No one. Why do you think this?
Bad take.
You get genocide either way; one is a guy trying to stop the genocide that’s been negotiating behind the scenes for months (and yes, also giving the Israelis arms), and the other guy wants to accelerate the genocide while also ending democracy.
I don’t believe you. Or more accurately, I don’t believe the alleged “leaks” from the White House about how mad Joe Biden is but it’s behind closed doors just trust me bro. This guy has been hard in the pocket for Israel his entire career, why wouldn’t he be now?
Mostly because Netanyahu has been souring on Biden real fast. Biden held up a delivery of bombs to Israel back in May, citing Israel’s plans to bomb Rafah. Netanyahu announced he was pushing forward anyway, and there was a big public spat about it. That sort of thing has been happening since Oct 7.
I mean one could say it’s all an act or something, but that strains credulity to me.
I’m not saying Biden is doing great here, I’d much prefer he take Bernie Sanders’ advice on this and stop weapon deliveries altogether. But it’s certainly fair to assess that Biden wants the genocide to stop, but is not doing enough to stop it.
It’s not the leaks, it’s the fact that Anthony Blinken has been holding talks in Cairo to try and negotiate a peace settlement.
It’s not a bad take. The post didn’t imply that there was a no-Genocide option
It’s a return2ozma post. Of course it’s a bad take.
It’s difficult to defend the idea that Biden has been trying to end the genocide. He’s had that power from day 1. If you give Israel a bullet, you have solid awareness that there is a good chance it will be used against a non-combatant. That’s hard reality. If Biden was not supportive of genocide he would place an embargo on the weapons being poured into the massacre. He also wouldn’t sanction the ICC when they attempted to call out the primary actors in the genocide. He has given enabling support to the campaign in multiple ways.
Biden is not a good man as he is portrayed, he is complex obviously, but the reality is that Hitler still petted his dog and was nice to his friends and family. Biden should be joining Netanyahu at the Hague, not sabotaging democracy by being virtually un-electable while at the same time working to make it even more obvious that the international order is only there to punish certain war criminals.
Anyway, I think the take is pretty on point.
Not as such, no. When congress appropriates funds, the president is legally obligated to disburse those funds for the purpose that they were appropriated for. This is a law, and it’s not something that’s up for debate. That was part of the underlying crime that Trump was first impeached for; he attempted to withhold funds corruptly. Could he have vetoed that? Sure. It also would have vetoed funding for Ukraine though. (And, just pointing out here that Trump would have vetoed assistance for Ukraine, while helping Israel kill more Palestinians faster.)
You can–and should–condemn his rhetoric, because he has been supportive of Israel waging war in Gaza. But he’s also been working behind the scenes, trying to negotiate a peace that Hamas will accept, and that Israel will accept. Even when he’s supporting Israel in public, it’s been clear that he’s been working to negotiate a truce.
The US also has laws against providing arms to military units that have been credibly accused of war crimes, but in Israel (also Ukraine) they simply don’t investigate allegations in order to keep the arms flowing. If Biden wants a legal casus belli to deny Israel arms, he has many to choose from, but he is actively choosing not to employ them.
He would need some kind of finding of fact in the US to support that, and that hasn’t happened AFAIK yet. The ICC has made that finding, but it wouldn’t be legally supportable to use that finding to withhold appropriated funding.
Yeah the US isn’t even a member of the ICC.
In fact the US is so NOT a member of the ICC that it’s currently federal law that if a US soldier was being held at the Hague, the US military would be obligated to invade The Netherlands in order to recover them
Or. Just maybe. We could actually care enough to pressure Biden.
No? Just going to shove your head in the ground and pretend politics is an immutable object?
I can’t imagine why Biden was already in so much polling trouble. It can’t possibly be the cult like atmosphere around him preventing him from contacting reality.
…And exactly, EXACTLY, how do you pressure him in a way that doesn’t actively risk making things far, far worse, not just in Israel, but here in the US as well? Because if your answer is, “don’t vote for him”, well, congrats, you’re going to make things worse.
You let them know. You don’t just sit on it. The one thing that will move a politician is knowing they can’t get elected again if they keep doing something. By throwing “But Trump!” at us, no matter how obliquely, you’re just protecting a genocide.
Are you not reading anything you just wrote?
If you do that with Biden, that means that Trump gets elected, and shit gets a whole helluva lot worse. Not just in Palestine, but everywhere. Of course, you’re going to say that I’m "throwing ‘But Trump!’ at you, but that’s not me - that’s the system that we live in.
You have a functionally binary choice. You can try to minimize damage, or not.
It’s your choice whether you, personally, do what you are capable of doing to minimize damage. And I hope that you have the intestinal fortitude to tell your LGBTQ+ friends to their face what you did, and why you did it, if it all goes the way I expect it will.
Yes, he’ll learn a lot by not being in office anymore. Then someone else will have the power to aid Isreal explicitly to carry out a genocide. But Biden will know. He’ll never hold office again , but hay. He’ll know. As the Supreme Court sactions the legalism of a Trump dictatorship and approve a continuation of the Japanese Internment Act. Expanded to all the other not-white people. Just as they argued during his first term, but Biden will know. Biden will have learned his lesson. While he has no political power of any kind. And when they’re shoving people in trucks and on boats without sufficient supplies to be dummped into places they aren’t from and have no resources to survive, and Biden will be sitting at home having fully learned his lesson.
Israel controls one of the largest political lobbies in America. No president who goes against the interests of the Israeli government will ever be elected until this changes.
AIPAC has only won one house race this year, and that was an already vulnerable incumbent. They’re nothing like titans like the NRA.
Ah yes. The insular Biden cult. I don’t know how deluded you need to be to buy this. No one, Not one person is in a cult of personality for Unkie Joe. No one. Why do you think this?